1. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    Hi, I am new here, just stumbled across the site while researching the latest on chemtrails. I had read somewhere that the shadow government actually pays bloggers to attempt to deceive the masses. Now that I've been to this thread, I believe it! I grew up watching the sky, and after the mid- to late-90's, I no longer observe the normal sky and classic cloud types that used to exist. I am a scientist with a strong chemistry and physics background, and have been awake to the chemtrails since about 2004. One can point to any piece of literature they wish, but seeing is believing. Like seeing Ted Gunderson, having only months to live, passionately pleading with congress to come clean and stop what he called the Death Dumps.
    Gunderson was the former FBI chief in Los Angeles. I have seen the leaked photos of large craft fitted from end to end with chemical tanks and specially designed sprayers. This and much more evidence, testimony, and scientific proofs of the damage these deliberate sprays are causing all the time is freely available on the internet for anyone to see. Whoever wants to stand for the illusion of persistent contrails either has not done enough research, or is working to cover up the truth. Either way, God bless us all. :cool:
  2. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  3. Chew

    Chew Senior Member

    My dad taught me how to identify cloud types when I was a kid in the early 70s. I observed and recorded meteorological data from the early 80s to the mid-2000s as part of my duties in the US Navy. I see the exact same cloud types now as back then. You can go to your local library and check out books about clouds printed in the 60s and 70s and see the exact same types we see today.

    Here's a meteorological handbook from 1906 that utilizes the same 10 cloud types that we still use today. http://books.google.com/books?id=Fb...a=X&ei=eJD3UJCWFI-FqQH0u4CoAg&ved=0CDoQ6AEwAQ
    • Like Like x 1
  4. David Fraser

    David Fraser Senior Member

    Awakening Lifeforce. I to have a strong science background yet presented with the same information I come to the opposite conclusion. I find the science to be poor at best and the is no physical evidence for it. All I see is an apparent case study of some pond sludge and snow which is supposed to represent a GLOBAL conspiracy. For me that is the real issue, the fact this is supposed to be on a global scale. One thing I am good at is understanding human nature and real conspiracies. I was in the British army during the first Gulf War. I was a nurse in my unit and afterwards got involved with the whole Gulf War Syndrome thing. There was an attempt by higher authorities to deny events and to cover things up. I won't go into to much detail as most of the investigations are part of public record, sufficed to say that the UK fielded an army if over 50000 during that conflict, and all these troops were subject to the Official Secrets Act, yet a few thousand came forward to highlight an injustice. What I am now expected to believe now is to believe that hundreds of thousands of people, many of whom will be on low or minimum wage, are involved in a global event that may have the potential to harm their families. In a world of mobile phones and digital technology, a world that has some of the most intrusive press and investigative technology, a world in recession where someone could earn hard cash with a good story, in a world of Wikileaks, in this world not.one person has come forward. Now that is not just hard to believe but unbelievable.
    • Like Like x 1
  5. cloudspotter

    cloudspotter Senior Member

    Which cloud types no longer exist?
  6. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    I believe they are spraying something. There is enough evidence for me and the debate has been settled for me a long time. Water is easy to use as an excuse for the trails and sure you could use those "ballast barrels" to test the craft. They just started doing that after 1995? I watch the skies and always have. Things have changed alot, and water and soil tests show that something is going on. The fake clouds are affecting the incoming light, and so, our earth. Communities have been proposing legislation about this, and I hope they continue to.
  7. cloudspotter

    cloudspotter Senior Member

    Any water and soil tests in particular?
  8. Mattnik

    Mattnik Moderator

    What is the one strongest piece of evidence that convinced you?
  9. Miss VocalCord

    Miss VocalCord Active Member

    If you just would have read the opening post of this thread you could have seen this image (the caption for the photo next to it says it was a 747 in 1969), or scrolling down to see them "in action" https://www.metabunk.org/posts/11180 ).

    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2013
  10. SR1419

    SR1419 Senior Member

    Yes, there are more trails in the sky then ever before....but long white, persisting, spreading contrails have always been observed ever since planes have flown high enough:


    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2013
  11. solrey

    solrey Senior Member

    I've always watched the skies as well, albeit with a trained eye having studied atmospheric sciences and being involved in the aviation industry in my younger years dating back to the '70's. Currently I'm a NWS spotter and member of the Cloud Appreciation Society. What's changed? Funny those of us who make a career and/or hobby out of studying/observing the atmosphere don't agree that things have changed a lot. Not only do those water and soil tests show normal levels found in nature, the methodology of those collecting the samples is seriously inadequate.

    Not according to empirical evidence. Since Pinatubo erupted, global aerosol concentrations have been steadily decreasing, reversing the slight "global dimming" that occurred from about 1960 to 1990. Since the early '90's we've been in a trend of global "brightening", exactly the opposite of what you claim.


    There aren't whole communities proposing legislation, just a small handful of misguided people scattered here and there that are harassing their local city/county council meetings and occasionally offering up poorly worded ordinances and such.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2013
    • Like Like x 4
  12. Rico

    Rico Active Member

    I'm no debunker, but so far, the only thing I see in this thread involves highlighting where people make threats to shoot down airplanes--and I think it's all in good reason. Now, I don't believe in the current chemtrail conspiracy myself, so I am a little biased, but I think it is absolutely criminal to see threats posed because what if my family are on board some of the aircraft that are being accused of "spraying chemtrails," what then. What if it was YOUR family on board?

    I grew up watching the skies too. I've been an aviation buff since I was around 8 or 9, and today, I fly airplanes and know enough about the sky I navigate around when I strap myself into some metal crate. The sky is still mostly the same to me. I still see the same types of clouds. and the same interactions that take place as the seasons go by. Granted, there are more of what I would call condensation trails, but that can be explained easily by the way aviation has changed over the past one hundred years. There are other pilots and experts who occasionally cruise by this forum too who also understand a little bit about how things work, such as why persistent contrails exist and what not. I'll take your word that you are strong into chemistry and physics, but that doesn't necessarily mean you are an expert in meteorology. Maybe you know a few things, but hey, I think I have a fairly well-grounded background on how things work "up there" myself. Even if you think all of us, including myself, are shadow government bloggers or what not, you should really try to "digest" some of the information on this site and make up your own mind.

    As for those leaked photos of large craft fitted with chemical tanks, you do know the saying that a picture is worth a thousand words right? Why don't you post them somewhere on this forum?
    • Like Like x 1
  13. MikeC

    MikeC Closed Account

    Unfortunately this shows nothing except that even peole of "high calibre" can fall for hoaxes - he also claimed that the Oklahoma bombings and 9/11 were carried out by the US Govt.

    His public paranoia was quite breathtaking -

    -Death of a public paranoid

    I agree - persistent contrails are not an illusion - they are reality.
  14. FreiZeitGeist

    FreiZeitGeist Senior Member

    About Ted Gundeson Chemtrail-Claimes. He named only one verifiable fact.
    He said in on of his Videos

    In Lincoln, Nebrasca, the
    Air national guard has a base


    ... on a civilian used Airport. You can go there. You can take pictures of the "unmarked Airplanes". Every Time they land or start from there.

    and all pictures of the military planes from there I found shows that they are marked


  15. MikeC

    MikeC Closed Account

    Ah yes - Fort Sill.....which has a runway that is apparently too short for KC-135's at only 5001 feet long - link is to publically available air navigation information about the airfield.

    there has been lots of discussion about Gunderson's claims, including the ANG aircraft one, on ATS - eg this thread - lots of interesting discussion, and lots of believer angst over the inevitable debunking.
  16. GregMc

    GregMc Senior Member

    • Like Like x 2
  17. PCWilliams

    PCWilliams Active Member

    If seeing is believing, i ask you to see Debunked: ChemTrails and ChemClouds, it's only 8 minutes long. :rolleyes:
    • Like Like x 1
  18. PCWilliams

    PCWilliams Active Member

    Another great book is Cloud studies (1905) :rolleyes:
  19. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    There is massive amounts of data published, just look online. We could try to debate and try to debunk each and every result until the cows come home, of course. Here is a link explaining more about the Chemtrail trolls I found the other day -- a.k.a., ChemTROLLS
    Official Chemtroll Song
  20. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    Official ChemTROLL song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVgqTwDsewY
    It's true what you said, "make up your own mind." I did. No one will believe the truth if you tell them.
    In fact, the truth is often the hardest thing to believe. There is hard data of ALARMING increases in
    certain chemicals from spraying. I've heard and considered all the explanations given by the disinformation
    agents, paid bloggers, and skeptics. The ruling is GUILTY GUILTY GUILTY OF covering up and denial, and what
    amounts to an outright assault and attack on humanity. We are under attack.
    Furthermore, advanced programs and systems put in place to placate us from taking the needed action include the
    way I was directed to this most advanced disinformation site because I was trying to find contact information of
    actual chemtrail pilots. Of course, there may be no pilots, maybe it's all automated now. Bill Gates can do it by remote control.
    A city on a hill cannot be hidden, they say. The truth will be shouted from the rooftops, in the name of Jesus, and these evil operations
    will end one day. Amen.
  21. Belfrey

    Belfrey Senior Member

    What is this hard data that shows alarming increases in certain chemicals from spraying?
  22. Belfrey

    Belfrey Senior Member

    Should be no trouble for you to link to an example of what you mean, then.
    • Like Like x 2
  23. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    And for the record, I DO NOT ADVOCATE VIOLENCE against the murderers who run this operation. Nor do I advocate violence against ANYONE OR ANYTHING. Just to be clear. The folks on here advocating violence are just as bad as the guys spraying us. You CANNOT solve a problem with the same type of thinking that created it. Nor can you "fight" for peace! But LOVE is stronger than death :)
    I ask, if this is all water vapor, then why are communities all over the world introducing legislation to ban chemtrails over their communities? How could something be banned that doesn't exist? Do you know how many "hot" music videos and artists are popping up with hit songs and music videos to teach our youth about this.
  24. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    I don't have time to post the 13+ years of data that researchers have made available. When I was younger we had to use books to find things out, but now we have google and internet, so if you are seeking this hard data, it's not hard to find at all. Go to www.google.com or your favorite search engine.
    Have a HAARPY Day!
  25. Belfrey

    Belfrey Senior Member

    That's good to hear, although the many examples on this thread show that plenty of "chemtrails" believers are advocating violence - which is one reason that the conspiracy theory is not harmless. People often ask, "If you don't believe in chemtrails then why do you bother spending time debunking it?" This is partly why.
    Because the people introducing such legislation, like yourself, have swallowed a conspiracy theory without any evidence that it's true. It does not mean that they (or you) have special knowledge about the existence of chemtrails.
    I've seen a few. Do you think that is evidence for the existence of chemtrails, or for the existence of chemtrails believers?
    I'm a little older than you. I clearly remember seeing persistent contrails when I was a young child. There are more now, mainly because there is a lot more air traffic now than there was when you and I were children.
  26. Mattnik

    Mattnik Moderator

    To save time, can you suggest the best source for this data? Just so we can be clear we're discussing the same thing.
  27. Belfrey

    Belfrey Senior Member

    I (and the other members here) have looked at many, many such test results - I'm just giving you the opportunity to discuss some that you find particularly convincing. They generally show normal amounts of elements that are naturally abundant in the environment, and I've yet to see any which show an increase over time of any of them, let alone showed evidence that they were sprayed from aircraft.
  28. Jay Reynolds

    Jay Reynolds Senior Member

    So, show us this massive data, yes, bring it out here in the open. I see your video speaks respectfully of Cliffford Carnicom and his "Red Wine Test". Do you feel that test delivers "data"? If so, where is it? He has people gargle wine and spit it out, then looks at it and makes a claim that the spit and wine mixture shows something. Where is the data in that? Why do you find it in any way compelling?

    We are extremely open here and really want to know what you find so interesting. So, show us what it is.

    BTW, the 13 years of data started out as a hoax 15 years ago, but the folks with that data don't want you to fully understand where all this came from.

    It came from a single source which I carefully ferreted out 13 years ago and explain here:

    Such a big deal from a lie. A tempest from a teapot. From a White Supremacist, no less. This is the foundational work for what you believe.
  29. solrey

    solrey Senior Member

    Saying "communities all over the world" is a bit of a mis-leading exaggeration don't ya think? Come on, anybody can submit "legislation" at the local level to their city or county councils as long as they can convince just one of the council members to sponsor it. The reality is that just a handful of hardcore believers have introduced ordinances to a handful of city/county councils in what, two or three countries.

    I'm pushing 50 and have been keenly observing the sky for as long as I can remember. Currently I'm a NWS spotter and member of the Cloud Appreciation Society. Some of my first memories are of the sky. Persistent contrails, and how their morphology followed weather patterns is something I noticed on my own that inspired me to learn about meteorology, aviation and the related science, which became my educational and career path. I was reading college level books on those subjects when I was like 10. Being involved in the field of aviation throughout the '80's and early '90's, I saw the growth in commercial passenger and cargo flights, the increased efficiency of new high by-pass turbofan engines, and the logical resultant increase in contrails. I seriously doubt you have the level of training, experience or observation of the sky as I do and I find all the so called "evidence" from chemtrail believers to be seriously lacking to the point of non-existent.

    That's kinda disturbing to me and one of the reasons I debunk this crap. So what do you plan to do should you ever find these pilots? There are quite a few pilots on this forum ya know.

    As for those tests, as others have stated all I've seen are elements common in nature and within the ranges of expected natural concentrations and variability. I'm not aware of any "chemtrail" studies using standard scientific methodology of ongoing systematic sample collection to generate a time series of data that provides evidence for an increase in any alleged "chemtrail" compounds over time.

    Double face-palm. I would look forward to having that discussion with you on another thread if you'd like.

    Perhaps these comments should be moved to new or appropriate existing threads covering those subjects to avoid cluttering the important topic of this thread?

  30. jvnk08

    jvnk08 Active Member

    I'm honestly glad folks like yourself are such a tiny minority... if everyone had such, erm... "logical reasoning skills", nothing would ever get done in the world.
  31. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    We have come to the conclusion that there is no reason to be a member of this site. We already know what will be said here in reaction to this, and that's fine. The true reason for being here was to sample the sophistication of the disinformation. People on the fence about chemtrails may be directed here and fall into the disinformation trap. The "arguments" and "evidence" presented by the disinformation representatives is weak, at best. For those who find their chemtrail concerns placated by the lies here, we feel sorry. We have to laugh at the replies made to my posts here.

    This has been a study for us into how the well trained disinformation agents covertly persuade weak-minded people. Two replies especially made us laugh. One is "show us the evidence." Really? Like we said and now say again, there is so much credible independent scientific evidence to support a massive coverup, that asking us to refer to one specific piece makes no sense.

    Anyone can easily use their favorite search engine and spend the rest of his or her life going over all the data. To provide no stronger argument than to keep repeating "show us evidence, show us data" only shows an aggressive disinformation expert hoping to wear us down by throwing confusion at each and every piece of data...so we sit and spin our wheels making no progress to stop the illegal experiments.

    Someone else says something to the effect that they spend all this time in here critiquing our every word simply because they are worried that someone would attempt to harass a chemtrail pilot. Seriously, do you think you are fooling us or that we take you're criticisms seriously?

    As far as those on here who are not professional paid bloggers working for "intelligence," but simply brainwashed and still living in the illusion... there is nothing that we can say or really need to say to convince them. Some people can be shown proof of something from ten angles at once and still their minds just refuse to accept the truth simply because they do not want to.

    Ex-millitary are coming out on interviews to confirm what we and many others already know. Chemtrail pilots and even entire governments are whstleblowing as of late. Stating that the sky was always like this (or that it just got "worse" because of increased traffic) is an easy statement to make, albeit a false one - and the only proof we need is to look at the sky, and know how it used to be, and how quickly and drastically it changed.

    There are those who know the truth and work hard to convince readers otherwise. We are not in need of any convincing anymore. And we can't convince many of you here who say chemtrails are not real, because you also know we are correct and wish to make an example of us here to deceive innocent readers.

    Long story short, the cat is out of the bag. No amount of deception and debate can convince us as a tanker flies overhead dumping poison on us. Chemtrails are no longer the "elephant in the room that we all pretend is not there." There are too many speaking up, and no amount of weak cover stories is going to stop the momentum of truth. We spend a lot of time on this post, as it will be our last one on this 5-Star Disinformation site. If we waste much time debating you who deny the truth, then the dark wins. Instead the time should be spent finding peaceful, logical, rational ways to stop the eugenics. Blessed Be :cool:
  32. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

  33. Rico

    Rico Active Member

    Seriously, I think you made your conclusions before even coming to this site.

    I do recall in another thread that when people asked you a "show us the evidence" question, you simply said you weren't going to dig through 13 years of information of what "researchers" have made available. Gee. You know, if you had any concrete evidence that chemtrails are being sprayed, it probably wouldn't take that much effort on your part to show it. So why don't you do it?

    Yes, anyone can use their favorite search engine to look up something. But just because you find a hit on a search engine doesn't mean the information is accurate.

    As far as harassing pilots go, personally, I find this is a real concern. Not just for the pilots, but for civilians who embark on planes that you suspect are spraying chemtrails. So, what it boils down to is this: can you truly verify who these chemtrail pilots are, what aircraft they fly, where they fly, and what exactly differentiates these planes form non-spraying planes? If so, enlighten us "brainwashed" folk, as you like to call us. What information I have found on the subject involves photographs framing known airlines and cargo operators for misdeeds with trails that look exactly like contrails.

    If ex-military and governments are indeed coming out and "confirming" what you already know, then it's certainly not public knowledge. Why don't you show us more? Maybe it will help us "brainwashed" folk.

    I have worked in the airline and aviation business for almost eight years, with much of that time involved operating out of a large hub-sized airport. Never once in my work day has anyone even mentioned chemtrails or are even concerned about white streaks in the sky. So, either all the workers I've worked with are government shills, or that quite simply, the chemtrail theory is on such a fringe that it is immaterial. You don't have to believe me, and seriously, if you can swallow up a lesser paid job, you can easily pick up a ramp position at a nearby airport and check this out yourself--up close and personal. Airlines are always hiring for the front lines, and it would put you up close-and-personal to so-called chemtrail planes.

    And seriously, why do you have to work so hard to "convince" readers, if you have any hard evidence at all? From what posts I have seen from you, you haven't even tried to debate. People ask you questions, and you go right ahead to call them disinformation agents with no questions asked. And quite frankly, it doesn't make you credible at all.
    • Like Like x 2
  34. Ross Marsden

    Ross Marsden Senior Member

    Awww, that was beautiful!

    Before you go, I'd like to know more about the lies and disinformation you say is posted here.
    Could you quote just one instance of what you think is a lie, and one instance of what you think is disinfo.
    We could discuss it a bit, and then if they turn out to be a lie or disinfo., we can post a correction.

    That would be a logical and rational way to resolve the disagreement we obviously have as evidenced by your almost-last-posting.

    Thanks, and Peace.
    • Like Like x 2
  35. Rico

    Rico Active Member

    You do realize that it only costs about $10 /yr to maintain a domain name, right?
  36. Billzilla

    Billzilla Active Member

    So what?
    My domain cost me a fair bit per year to run and I do it because many other people get benefit from it. Your argument along those lines is completely baseless.
    The reasons I know 'chemtrails' are pure fiction are -
    - There's never been any spraying equipment found on any airliner anywhere in the world.
    - There's never been any equipment found at any airport anywhere to service any airliner for 'chemtrails'.
    - There's never been any aircrew come forwards and say they've been doing it.
    - There's never been any ground crew come forwards and say they've been doing it.
    - There's no mention of any 'chemtrails' in any of the very comprehensive Wikileaks documents.
    - There is no proven link of any odd chemicals coming out of the sky from airliners and entering our biosphere.
    - There has been geoengineering projects going on since the 1950's by both the military and civil companies, but they have never been secret.

    I am a retired 747 Captain and in twenty-five years of flying have never seen the remotest hint of anything to do with the completely fictional 'chemtrails'.
  37. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    From contrailscience.com:
    "I’m not paid for this. I do not work for anyone in conjunction with this site. I’m just some guy. Email me at:

    I also post on YouTube as “Epoxynous
    If you would like to change the avatar icon next to your posts, just sign up at gravatar with the same email address you use here.
    I also run metabunk.org
    Posted by Uncinus (Mick) at 1:28 pm"

    Ok Mick, so you have set up all these pages, and planned ahead that this would be up through 2017. When I came in as a newbee and posted anything to the effect that humanity is being lied to about chemtrails - I am hit within minutes by one, two, or more posters playing psyops 101 with me. Even when I post on Fakebook something for my friends, I don't get replies as dependably as I did on here. I'm sure the paid writers for this Illuminati-run website have back office software and get immediate mobile alerts when it's time warp the minds of innocent readers who get sucked up into this garbage and happen to post.

    Don't worry everyone, everything is ok. Now just take your flu shot and give this fluoride-added water to your newborn.

    John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    John 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

    John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

    Rev 2:16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

    Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2013
  38. Mattnik

    Mattnik Moderator

    "I don't get replies as dependably as I did on here. I'm sure the paid writers for this Illuminati-run website have back office software and get immediate mobile alerts when it's time warp the minds of innocent readers who get sucked up into this garbage and happen to post."

    Email, it's called email Awakening_lifeforce.

    Mick, how many posts do I have to make before I get a payout? I'm moving house soon and I'm totally broke.

    Seriously though, a quick Google tells me I can register a domain for roughly £4.99 a year - that's hardly breaking the bank. Mick has always been open with the sites he runs, so why act as though you've unmasked some massive deception?

    What specific items of 'disinfo' are on this site? If you can identify them then we can discuss them one at a time.
  39. awakening_lifeforce

    awakening_lifeforce New Member

    That's great Billzilla. And these are the actions you are defending:

    "The military now admits to some horrific cold-war human experiments around the country. A handful of hospital patients were secretly injected with plutonium. Babies and pregnant women unknowingly received radioactive iodine. And from 1946 to 1953, 73 mentally-disabled children in Massachusetts were fed oatmeal containing rradioactive calcium."
    Bear in mind, the media is here again forced to pretend that those experiments stopped. Truth is they are ongoing, and chemtrailing is only part of them. So this, Mr. Mick West, is what you stand for. I hope you can sleep well at night - well, apparently you cannot!

    Secret human testing: Victims in St. Louis speak, demand answers
  40. Mattnik

    Mattnik Moderator

    I'm going to look at your claims, but can I please ask that you post in a regular font size? It's playing havoc with the formatting on my phone.

    My first observation: None of that is evidence for so called chemtrails.

    As has been asked previously, please show the clearest evidence of chemtrails that you have.